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Discussion (93 Comments)Read Original on HackerNews
Sure, I could wait 7 or 8 years until I qualify via insurance, but is that really worth the risk for what is an easily absorbed cost to me? Especially when I have a friend in her late 30s who just went through a very rough bout of shingles?
It makes sense to have targets like age 50 for population-wide public health recommendations. But it can and does infect people of much earlier ages.
Recent articles like this make me think I'll go ahead.
¹ The vaccine strain tends to be much more mild than the wild strain, and indeed it was quite unpleasant, but not extremely painful for me. The wild strain is considerably more painful and linked to a greater incidence rate of complications. Please do not skip chickenpox vaccinations for your kids, the minor risk of latent infection from attenuated vaccine is far less harmful than the consequences of not vaccinating. Most important of all, if you have a cluster of blisters or rash on one side of your body that keep popping up, make sure to see a doctor and get on antivirals within the first 72 hours for best results.
I was vaccinated in the early 70s when it was a single dose. With measles in the news recently, I asked my doc to add a measles antibodies test to my blood draw. Came back negative. No immunity. I went to the local pharmacy and got an MMR booster the next day.
https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/some-...
I tell me patients this to increase uptake, so we can reduce alzheimer's prevalence.
(I'm a doctor)
I had shingles in my 30s. It was the sickest I've ever been.
It's stupid too, because the question I answered "wrong" wasn't clear. It basically sounded like they were asking me if I currently had a cold or covid.
We even have anabolic steroids that were approved for muscle wasting in cancer patients, but if you can find a doctor willing to write the prescription and a pharmacy that won’t question it, anyone can have pharmacy grade Anavar for the gym, completely legal. In theory the doctor writing the prescription is putting their license at risk, but enforcement is so lax that there are “anti-aging” clinics all over that will prescribe testosterone and Anavar to anyone with a credit card.
So with a documented history of shingles you should have no problem getting a prescription written. It would be worth a quick check with your insurance company because it might even be covered if your doctor will fill out the form and attach evidence of the past diagnosis.
I think the age 50 target is dated. With reduced childhood incidence of chicken pox, we're all exposed to varicella zoster less, and it seems like the ages of incidence of shingles is falling. Public health recommendations are slow to catch up with research (especially for vaccinations, these days).
My research at the time led me to the same conclusion: Since we've basically eradicated chickenpox, we're not exposed to the varicella zoster virus as much as previous generations (via children that have chickenpox). Without exposure our antibodies / resistance fade out.
Since we had chickenpox, the virus is already in us and dormant. When it wakes up and decides to do its thing, our bodies have forgotten how to fight it effectively compared to previous generations - and as a result, the incidence of shingles is increasing in younger populations compared to previous generations.
My doctor said vaccination for under 50 is only indicated after multiple occurrences of shingles... so here's to hoping I'm good til the guidelines change.
People (well, Americans and Canadians at least) in their 40s now generally didn't get vaccinated as children, as their parents didn't have the option. It will be different for the next generation.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/free-chickenpox-vaccinati...
https://www.shingrix.com/side-effects/
I tried to go private (also not 50), but everyone just refused. Pharmacy, GP, private GP.
Currently I'm arranging it in the third country because WTAF.
(UK becoming the dirtiest and sickest country of Europe one more time)
(I don't like this logic and if I had the option of just going to Walgreens and getting vaccinated, I'd do that this afternoon. I'm just saying, there's a logic to it.)
The mechanism is that people with the shingles vaccine are less likely to visit the hospital to treat their shingles and therefore less likely to receive a diagnosis of dementia from a hospital.
Infections generally increase the risk of future dementia. Like the more colds you have throughout life.
"association" undersells it a bit, because the data is better than the typical cohort study, which has issues like "what if people who got the vaccine are also richer and care about their health more?". There's quasi-randomization going on. From the more in depth article that's linked:
>Research is also revealing unexpected interventions that help to keep ageing minds sharp. One of the most promising derives from an analysis by Pascal Geldsetzer of Stanford University and his team of a natural experiment in Wales. In 2013 the British region started offering people aged 70-79 free vaccinations through the public-health system. This change resembled an RCT, in that a large number of people were separated almost at random into two groups: those who had already turned 80 in the weeks before the programme started, and so were not eligible to be jabbed; and those who turned 80 in the weeks after, roughly half of whom were duly vaccinated.
And similar questions about obesity "causing" many diseases, sunburns causing skin cancer (although that sounds somewhat plausible) etc.
(You should very much want to avoid any chance of getting shingles, though; it's a nightmare.)
I did have chicken pox as a kid, but have not had shingles nor the vaccine (yet). A co-worker was laid up for a week after his shingles vaccine, but that's obviously just one data point.
But, I've been considering getting the Shingrix series even if I have to pay for it. I turn 60 this year. Shingles doesn't sound fun.
Whoa wait what? This is the first time I’ve heard of this - is this actually common knowledge?
When I learned it, it was in the context of the influenza and similar common viruses.
It's actually more nuanced than that. If you want to read more: https://www.openevidence.com/ask/bccc3cc2-e15d-4fb0-a0c5-16f...
There was a study that showed that people who had severe influenza (they were hospitalized) were 3 times more likely to develop dementia. And there are mouse models that show that frequency respiratory virus infections can increase may contribute to brain aging (in mice).
>someone who worked in daycare and often got sick with the flu or similar, has a higher risk of dementia (statistically-speaking).
I can't find any evidence of this being true. I can find evidence that primary school teachers have lower rates of dementia. Pediatricians also have lower rates of dementia, so I find this highly doubtful.
The lesson is to be extremely suspicious of findings of causation based on observational studies.
Hoowee, it made me sick, but only for a day (twice, as you get a booster, six months later).
Had chickenpox (and measles, at the same time), when I was a kid. That was fun.
My mother used to get recurring bouts of the shingles. Definitely not fun.
Don't get chickenpox.
I want folks to get it but - I feel "Just Get It" admonitions foster a vibe that the cost is negligible.
I recall seeing a few discussions on HN comments hypothesizing that immune system stimulation via the vaccine might be the root cause. Now that the Amyloid hypothesis is on the wane, hopefully we'll explore other paths.
Oh? What did I miss?
TL;DR A lot of evidence supporting the Amyloid hypothesis is suspect.
Unfortunately the apparent ant-dementia effect of this old vaccine (Zostavax) recently turned out to be a statistical illusion: https://youtube.com/watch?v=qlTnnQytOJ0
It is not clear whether the effect from Shingrix (the new one) is real or not. We currently don't have a case-control study which could prove causation.
The earlier you start the better.
This means addressing hearing loss, e.g. via hearing aids.
Injecting people with a shingles vaccine is far easier than the others you listed, which is why it stands out.